Now that we have entered that very special time of year when all high school seniors are beginning to stress out about choosing the right college, writing a personal statement, and playing that "numbers game", I'm curious about your opinion regarding college as a choice. Check out the link, read the article, and post your thoughts on Mr. Stephans's ideas. Should everyone, anyone, or no one plan to grad from college.
Why Go to College at All?
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ReplyDelete“A world where people make their own decisions,” says Dale J. Stephens. Everyone’s experience in college is different depending on what you want to study. Doesn’t that mean you’re making your own decision? Whether you want to go to college or not is your choice to make. It isn’t mandatory. Now, let’s reflect on this article. According to Dale J. Stephens, going to university doesn’t help you face the real world. In other words, college is like a small box in which you only interact with the people inside the box and not the ones that are mingling outside of it. He also believes that whatever you learn in college is just like what you would learn in a regular school. Reading this and trying to understand it made me wonder whether he thought that college was just a waste of time. How can you expect to be a certified surgeon by “accessing resources on your own,” as he said it. You need a diploma, you need experience, and you need enough knowledge to perform the task. Maybe Stephen was referring to more simple jobs, however, he should have specified.
ReplyDeleteReferring to Reason 2: Socializing and developing a network of friends and contacts, I believe Stephen is not in a position to answer that question. As mentioned in the article, he left college after a brief time there. His response is that college is a place where you only interact with people “on your dorm floor and in your classes.” You obviously won’t be able to interact with other people if you only spend a “brief” amount of time in a certain area. It takes some courage as well as some time to open up to people even in a larger environment, or as Stephen would say, “The real world.”
Status. If you plan on going to college just for the name of the school and only for a semester or two, I don’t think it’s a wise decision. Let’s say you only spend one semester at Columbia University. When you will apply for your job and they ask you why you only spent one semester, what are you going to answer? Unless you make up some convincing lie, then there’s no point of even going there. If you made the effort of applying there and the college made the effort of accepting you because of your qualities and achievements, you might as well stay, learn, and excel academically.
Stephen believes that students that attend university don’t have enough responsibilities to actually “discover themselves”. My response to this is, once again, that university is a personal choice and that everyone’s responsibilities vary. In some cases your responsibilities might only consist of studying for tests and handing your assignments in on time. However, if you own an apartment and you don’t live on campus, your responsibilities could be from cooking, to grocery shopping, to studying, to cleaning up your apartment, so on and so forth.
Although not all jobs require a college degree, I do believe that it is better to have one just in case you don’t get the job you wanted and your alternate job requires a degree. Stephen, on the other hand, believes that many of the courses that you take in college won’t be useful in your career. He said: “Taking a psychology course doesn’t mean you know what it’s like to work as a psychologist.” What’s an internship then? The whole point is to learn about psychology but as well as getting hands on during your internship.
Why go to college? Because you want the college experience before you get thrown into the real world. Right after high school, you’re not ready for what the world has to offer yet. As a whole, my view on college is completely different from what Stephen’s opinion is. If you’re financially stable, I say that everyone should get to go to college, but if you’re not, there’s such a thing as financial aid and scholarships. If you think that university is a waste of time, think again.
You make a strong point in diffusing his argument about social networks by throwing his own example back at him: "a brief time." Excellent use of citing the evidence. You must remember Stephens is an American, which means that there are thousands of very lovely careers and choices he has access to without any formal uni study. This changes if you are from, say Taiwan or Korea where most of the population holds advanced degrees.
ReplyDeleteYou mention that uni is sort of an adult training ground. This is one view of it. Neither you nor Stephens address the "learning for learnings sake" that many degree holders and professors stress. Do you think this is important or do you see uni as a vocational training ground?
Why go to college? To become something? Someone? To keep up with your parents expectations? To learn something? Experience? The questions in my head kept piling up as I began thinking about universities and where to apply as well as what to do in the future. Everyone has their own reason about attending college. For some it may be to live up to their parent’s expectations by getting into an Ivy League such as Harvard or Columbia or keeping up the legacy of attending Yale. Others on the other hand simply want to experience college life, dorms, parties, being more independent, and getting prepared for the “real world.”
ReplyDelete“If you want to learn, college is the last place you should go,” Mr. Stephens states. I believe this really depends on who you are, your motives in college, as well as your surroundings and which college you’re attending. Nowadays, when looking at colleges, many students take into account what kind of atmosphere and environment they might be surrounded by. They research every bit of information, from whether it is a party school, or a school with a large campus, to the suicidal rates and campus life. A student that attends a college that has the reputation of being a party school should know how to balance schoolwork and their social life. However, if they fall for negative peer pressure and begin to take their social life more seriously than their school, they won’t learn what they came to study.
“When you go out into the world, there’s no structure like that. A job doesn’t give you a syllabus.” Although he may be absolutely right, colleges and universities prepare you for facing “reality” in the future. To me, going away to college means having more responsibilities, being more independent, as well as making my own decisions. After all, Mommy and Daddy aren’t going to be in college with me, forcing me to do my homework, cooking for me, or even reminding me to do things that I usually always forget to do. And so at the end of the day, I am not only learning about what I’m studying, but I’m learning how to cook, to be more responsible, to be organized, to make my own bed, as well as to do the laundry.
“Learners should be able to access resources on their own terms.” He states. Now if you really sit and think about this, Mr. Stephens probably said this while having only a couple majors in mind. What about those going into medicine to become a doctor or even a surgeon? How will they have access to specific tools or resources? How will they be able to train, learn, and experience what it’s like to work at a hospital? Hands down, finding a hospital that hires them may be very difficult considering their circumstances. I don't know about you but I certainly would not authorize for someone who does not have a degree in medicine or has not had some kind of training to operate on a patient.
Many students nowadays, aim to get into top colleges in the United States such as Stanford, Brown, Yale, Harvard, and Columbia. We know all these universities and colleges because they're known to be the best, and so even just the name is very prestigious. Nevertheless, I personally believe that getting into one of the top universities is not just about the name, or status that you’re going to acquire by studying there, its about what you learn, what you become. It’s really not all about the name. For example a person wanting to go into programming or computer science or robotics who gets into MIT may learn almost the exact same thing as a person who gets into Virginia Tech. The only difference is the name. So honestly, attending college is not about the name, or what others want, it’s really all about you. What you want to do, what you want to experience, what you want to learn, and what you want to become.
You make the same point Jennifer does about medical studies needing specialized training. It's not the current way the western world works, but it could be effective if those wanting such a career could train, for the same number of years they would spend in school, with a practicing professional. Mentorship and journeymanship are outdated, but is that because they are ineffective or because of the industrial revolution and for profit universities?
DeleteOh, and can't you get more "real world experience" - making your bed, cleaning your house and paying bills if you are really out on your own working 40 hours a week? Living within your own budget, cutting required corners to survive is an excellent way to learn self-reliance.
DeleteI am surprised how much I disagree with Mr. Stephens, because of the fact that I don’t think college is for everyone. He just sounds to me like a kid who dropped out after elementary school and is now complaining about the importance of a college degree in today’s world. However, he has survived this long so I guess he has proven the point that college isn’t necessary.
ReplyDeleteI really disagree with his statement: “If you want to learn, college is the last place you should go….” For what I am planning to major on (Computer Science) it would be quite impossible to start a career without learning about programming at a university. Sure its possible to find lesson plans and other programming tutorials, but when he says that people don’t learn anything important in college is extremely false. All of school (including college) is mainly about learning how to problem solve and how to collaborate with others. Then as you advance to harder levels of schooling you learn more about a curtain area of interest (which is the main reason for college). He makes the point that going to college isn’t quite like actually doing what you are learning about (learning about programming is different from actually being a programmer for a company for example) but college is a necessary step in that direction.
For an introvert like myself, I am grateful for the opportunity to have a limited amount of people that I have to interact with in college. I don’t especially need that many friends, I would much rather have only a few really good friends. I wouldn’t mind living in what they called a “bubble,” but even if I did there are many opportunities outside of school (college) where you can make friends, as long as you know how. Making friends in school is the best practice for making friends later in life that anyone could have.
One of the only things that Mr. Stephens is: “It’s not that college creates success,” he said. “It’s that smart and motivated people in our society tend to go to college.” College doesn’t “create” success, but it helps to increase it. A smart person could get far, but a smart person who goes to college will be even more successful.
Mr. Stephens doesn’t have much experience with college, so he shouldn’t be complaining and winning about it. College has been incredibly helpful for millions of students. Even though not all careers necessarily require a college degree, obtaining one is beneficial nonetheless and the whole college experience is beneficial to you as a person both academically and socially.
Do you really think you could not learn computer programming by spending time working with computers and computer programmers? Let's say you get an intern position in a computer company working 40 hours a week, 50 weeks a year surrounded by computer experts. That's maybe 75% more time "working" on and with computer than taking college classes and writing papers.
DeleteNot trying to talk you out of uni, just playing devil's advocate.:)
I disagree with what Mr. Stephens says that if you want to learn college is the last place you want to go to. There is a reason why colleges have profesors so they could help you when you are stuck on one question. Sure you can learn all these things buy your self, but what you would learn in like a month students in colleges would learn it in like a week or so. One other reason he gives is about your status. He says that you can go to a really good college and then just quit after a semester. All that counts is that you went there. I disagree with that. When people will ask you where you went and how long you went for you would reply that you went for a semester despit the good name of the college people are going to think that there is something wrong with you. On the other hand if you told them that you graduated from that college they would be more impresed by you and would want to know more.
ReplyDeleteSelf-discovery one other thing Mr.Stephens mentions. I would argue that by saying colleges now a days recommend that you take the core courses first in your first year at a college, to try diffrent thing in the first year, so you know what you want to do and where you want to be in a few years after graduating. Whether you want to be an entreprenuer or a chef? The last reason Mr.Stephens gave was getting a markable degree and developing earning potential. Most of the colleges have co-op courses thes day. That means that students could work and study too. Which gives them them the experience to get diffrent jobs throughout their college years, and once again self-dicovering what they want to be. When you apply for a job after you graduate you have the work experience because you worked during your college years. Thats the first thing the employers see. They see that you have had work experience and you know what to do so they are impressed by it and they employe you. Therefore, I disagree with Mr.Stephens statements about not graduating from college.
Your point about being able to "check out" different fields is interesting. But, can't you do this if you are living out in the real world? You can volunteer, intern, apprentice and even work for pay for real industry professionals and learn from full-time, successful professionals instead of professionals who are "cloistered" safely into academic communities.
DeleteIf some high school student in Asia announces, "I do not want to go to a college," most of the people will stare at him or her with that "shame on you" look and think that either he has very low academic grades or he was grown up in poor family. I strongly disagree to Dale J. Stephens' idea. Looking at the reality of the world, I think that going to a college is very important.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I believe that there is no end in learning. While learning and finding yourself in society has value, without enough knowledge on the field, that will not be possible. Stephens says, “Taking a psychology course doesn’t mean you know what it’s like to work as a psychologist.” Yes, that is true. However, working as a psychologist without having listened to psychology course in a college will not do any good either. College is the step taken by students to approach to the real world. Without college education, in reality, it is not possible to have a job that requires professional knowledge and skills.
“You might end up limiting yourself if you only socialize with people on your dorm floor and in your classes,” says Stephens. However, he is making a serious omission in judgement right here. Socializing skills is also a factor that is very important and must-be-learned by college students. If a college is a place just for gaining information and learning them all, there would be no reason to attend college. People would rather study by themselves using online-lectures and books. College is also a place where people socialize and learn how to get along with others (it would be better if students are international). Obviously those skills can be used in real life when you get a job and have to communicate with others successfully. “College is a sandbox that gives you a false sense of reality,” commented Stephens. He added saying, “It’s much more beneficial to learn what it means to direct your own life.” I think college does not give you “false sense of reality” since every factors of real life exits: winners, losers, success and failure. Contrary to highschool where students were under protection of teachers and their parents, college is a place of reality where students can absorb information of their majors and learn their social skills.
Yes, finding a path of your own life, creating your way to success, learning skills that can be used in real life are meaningful. However, realistically, to not go to a college and build your own direction to success is a very dangerous decision to make and very challenging task. If you know that the companies that hires people, prefer graduate students and that job provides stable salaries, no one will be brave enough to make a choice not to attend college but find one’s way to success greater than that. Rather than going on a challenge with dreams and hope that they will find a light on the way of their path, it is more likely that they will choose a established way to success.
Your "Asia" slant throws a new idea into the current mix. I have experienced this second hand. The rules ARE different in most developed Asian countries that they are in the west. The degrees do matter and the name of the school does matter much more so than in the west. However, I still maintain that most college students do have a false sense of reality. Many are supported or aided financially by parents. They do not have to pay their own bills, budget their meager salaries in order to pay rent, eat, pay transportation to and from work, pay utility bills, doctor's bills, find insurance, etc. Many do not even work full time (or part time). Attending classes and doing your own laundry while someone else works and pays your bills is not training for the real world.
Delete"Is college for everyone? Anyone?" The article presented by Stephens can change the answer to this question, but really who decides whether we should go to college or not? I think it’s merely each individual who knows whether university is where he/she wants to go. Many people say that college is where you’re thrown to “reality” but I believe everyone has different reasons or means of going to college. It doesn’t particularly help you explore the real world but it allows you to find your major, responsibilities, abilities, and in whole yourself. According to Dale J. Stephens, “going to university doesn’t help you face the real world.”, “If you want to learn, college is the last place you should go”, It’s not that college creates success,” I totally disagree with these statements because in today’s world getting into an excellent university is a huge accomplishment. Not only getting into it but able to gain so much experience which later on helps you take immense decisions in your life.
ReplyDeleteAll the 5 reasons Mr. Stephen stated just seem to contradict what thousands of students think about university and the value of it. Stephen believes that students that attend university don’t have enough responsibilities to actually “discover themselves”. I believe that many of the students that go to university discover themselves and their ambitions. I can’t really say that universities fulfil the dreams that billions of students pursue but it surely increases your ability to make decisions and take upon responsibilities. Yes many students do go to college just to get away from home and live in a world with no one to question them but they’re many others who actually acquire great knowledge and skills.
After all this discussion on whether university if for anyone or everyone lets answer to this “why do we go to university?”Isn’t it a typical thing to go to university, obtain a degree and get an incredible job? Although not all jobs ask for a college degree but since the world is becoming a very competitive place and that a degree from Columbia University will be a straight ticket to your dream job rather than having to just wander around looking for jobs without a valuable degree. I believe that university is a personal choice and that everyone’s responsibilities diverge. From my perceptions university is not a waste of time it is a great period of time that’ll decide your future and explore to you something that you wouldn’t have imagined probably. If not going to college was such an easy decision no one would bother to even attempt to accept the worldly challenges. To not go to a college and create your own track to success is a very risky and challenging decision. High School is a very cold place where everything is assigned, asked or questioned to you but in college the only thing that matters is how well you adapt the change from "a place where everything was given to you “ to "a place where you have to struggle to fulfil your dreams. College experience is beneficial to you in many ways and hopefully going to college should not be a wrong decision.
You manage to argue both sides. Can you explain why YOU think college is a good idea for YOU? Bear in mind that uni education, a degree - be it bachelor's or masters or doctorate- is no longer a guarantee of a successful job search. Economists are calling your generation "the screwed generation" (Newsweek) because of the depressed job market coupled with the excessive level of public and personal debt.
DeleteAlso, if you believe that high school is cold and impersonal, then university will severely depress you. The only one who cares if you succeed in most "name" schools is you. No professors will come to check on you, no one in the offices will help you without your ID number, and many of your classmates will be trying to best you so they will be the one to survive and move on. Not all unis are like this, but many, many are....
Having read this entire article, I find it quite unbelievable that anyone in today’s day and age can be so naïve as to actually suggest that college is a waste of time! I have to assume that Mr. Stephens may have used his arguments to justify not attending college to his parents or to himself but he’ll never convince me that it’s a waste of time. If everyone thought like Mr. Stephens, this world would still have been stuck in the dark ages or at the best, not evolved beyond the agricultural stages of development. Human beings would never have had the technological advancements to transplant human organs or travel to the moon!
ReplyDeleteI refute all of Mr. Stephens’ arguments for not attending college. I believe the biggest advantage of attending college is that it allows us to broaden our knowledge in a sustained, structured and disciplined learning environment. I agree that discipline has to exist within oneself as well, but I also know that discipline can be taught. If this was not the case, most national armies would not exist or at worse only exist with ill-disciplined soldiers. College education allows us to further enhance and advance everything that we learn from Pre-K to 12th grade and allows a student to find his/her place in the world in terms of what they want to achieve. I think a college education opens our minds and broadens our future horizons.
To a certain degree, “what you know” is equally important today as “who you know”. One of the advantages of attending a college is definitely the contacts that students make and networks that are established. Mr. Stephens is over-emphasizing the disadvantages of attending college downplaying the advantages of a college education. Maybe his parents may have accepted his arguments but I’m almost certain that most parents, and specially mine, will laugh if I even dared to suggest that a college education is of no value!
One of the reasons I attended college was pressure from my father, who got his degree courtesy of the first GI Bill in the 1940s. You are correct that college can provide you with a sustained, structured and disciplined learning environment. Actually, you are the first reply I've read that touches on something Mr. Stephens cannot dispute. Many young people, particularly, need the structure of courses and deadlines in order to apply themselves to a discipline. However, let us remember that Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak, Michael Dell, Mark Zukerberg, Paul Allen and Bill Gates, and Larry Ellison (who just purchased my home island for 500 million dollars), all dropped out of college. BTW, Ellison bought the island from high school dropout David Murdoch.
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ReplyDeleteI don’t know about everyone but I personally have always wanted school to end as quick as possible so I can get into the college world. A world where you are independent as in you learn to stand on your feet. You’re mature enough to take your own decisions. You get to come across people you don’t know and get to learn so many new things from them. going to college is your first step in getting to know te otside world.“You learn how to follow directions, meet deadlines and memorize facts.” “When you go out into the world, there’s no structure like that. A job doesn’t give you a syllabus” says Mr. Stephens. I agree with the fact that in the outside world you don’t memorize thing but example you were to get a job in a company as the manager you have to follow the directions of the company, you have to meet with deadline and you kinda have to memorize some things so there is a structure you have to follow.
ReplyDeleteI agree with him when he says that status is the most valid reason to go to college. Yes everybody wants to go to a college that has a big name and things like that. Yes college dept can be or is an issue with many people but then there are alternatives you can get financial aid, scholarships loans and many other things. So it’s not a big deal.
Mr. Stephen views college as something that is not helpful and thinks that its not the place where we should go because, maybe he didn’t expect it to be what he wanted it to be because, since he was a kid he didn’t go to school or he was home schooled that’s why when he went to college and found it difficult to socialize with people or make friends or he felt uncomfortable because he’s not used to going to school. So it makes it difficult for him to go to college. He’s just not used to it. Mr. Stephens disagrees to the fact that graduates discover themselves in their years on campus. I don’t know why he disagreed to it because more than half of the people don’t know what they want to major in or what do they want to become so, when a person goes to college he/she can decide what they want to do by then.
I don’t share the same opinion as Mr. Stephen but I agree with few of the points, but people have different prospective so I think Mr. Stephens is correct on his side.
Karima, Try to argue one side or the other - you like to edge your way onto the fence. If you do disagree with the author - just disagree. You have some examples that support your ability to defend your opinion. The fact that over 4 - 6 years it takes to graduate, most college students do manage to grow up at least a little bit.Also a nice parallel on deadlines rules in college lining up to deadlines and rules in the work place - especially if you are right out of college and you haven't worked your way into the management level. But yes, unless you own the company, then you have to play by someone else'a rules.
DeleteGoing to college or not is a choice, and as a matter of fact it can have both positive and negative effects. I agree with Mr. Stephans when he says “If you want to learn, college is the last place you should go,” mainly because I’ve heard many stories related to this. I’ve been told that going to college is just to “pass time” and I tend to hear this line very often with businessmen. They say, what you learn in college is nothing like what you learn in the real world. Even Mr. Stephans seems to agree on that.
ReplyDeleteI disagree with Mr. Stephans when he says it’s the “last” place you should go. I believe it’s all about being at right place at the right time for example, if I were to college and I were to meet a rich Arab guy. This so-called rich Arab guy has a father in need of a smart guy to help put up an oilrig. He obviously has the money to do so but not the intelligence. I’ve gone to college, learnt all about oilrigs and I’m the perfect partner for the job. He funds the project and I’m the brain behind of all it. I’ve automatically made a ton of money. So college can also be all about finding the right contacts.
Going to college is helpful in ways that help organize children help give students responsibilities and more. I haven’t been to college yet so I wouldn’t know if college is just like school. I look at it in a different perspective. I’ve implanted in my brain that I’m going to college to experience what its like to live alone, party, socialize, and get as much as I can out of it. School and college in my opinion is just a preparation for the real world. I might just have a great idea with me right now but I feel it’s my own obligation to attend university.
There are risks in not going to college and that’s one reason I’m not taking a year off. For instance I take off 4 years to do this massive project. And at the end it fails and it leaves me unable apply for a good job because I have no college experience. I can of course go to college whenever but my 4 years of work has gone down the drain. Going to college is actually a big decision, and those thinking about taking a year off should really consider the risks and effects that it may have.
I like the fact that your see the ability to make the "right" contacts in somewhere that houses lots of people with enough money to afford the school. But what about the rich Arab guy's son? can't he take over dad's business? Why give you the job?
DeleteI do disagree that if you do something else for 4 years and the project fails, you have wasted the years. Failure is probably THE BEST training and learning ground. After that you probably have hundreds of ways not to do something. What did Edison say about hie nine hundredth attempt at the light bulb? "Now I know 900 ways not to do it." He saw it all as experiential learning at its best. Plus, taking the time off can make you way more ready for buckling down and actually learning something when and if you do decide to attend uni.
The title of the article raises the question in minds of many and also makes one think about how much of a crazy idea Mr. Stephan presents. After reading the article it makes me feel that the topic Mr. Stephan talks about is quite interesting and to an extent true as well. Why go to college at all if from the inside you know that you’re there to socialize? Why give parents false hope, that you’re studying. Also college is like school but with more people and a little more of expectations. College is a place where you specialize in your interests and a much respected institution. What’s the point of going to college if you forge yourself in, rote memorize, fool around and think of it as an opportunity to socialize. It is also very true that the smart ones mostly succeed because they are self- directed and understand that knowledge is the ultimate power. One thing that I do disagree about is that college doesn’t give a first-hand experience of real life, it does. When one stays away from parents and manages their own money that in many senses itself is teaching students how to live independently and unreliably. College definitely is a very respective institution and not a place to just fool around therefore it is for the students itself to understand the importance of college.
ReplyDeleteThe main reason that parents send children off to college is to study and they send them with a lot of trust and love. There’s no point of going to college just to give parents the false hope and party instead. Doing that students not only cheat themselves but they also cheat their parents. Also they take up unnecessary space in college, instead of them there could’ve been a more meritorious student who by chance didn’t get in. Though that doesn’t mean that one shouldn’t socialize at all, little bit of socializing is necessary. All Stephan wants people to know are their limits and responsibility and understand that college is no joke it’s serious. Though one thing that I disagree about is that Stephan makes a point about how dropping out from college after a semester or two is sufficient to live in this world of harsh competition. It certainly is not true, if someone wants to start their business and is confident then sure it’s their choice to drop out but that’s only when we talk business. What about when someone wants to be a doctor and start their own clinic? Is it sufficient for them to just drop out after first or second year in med-school? I don’t think so that would be harmful to the humankind. Therefore the point that college doesn’t provide experience is where I disagree.
In general I believe college is something very important, but if you’re just going to fool around then you might as well just sit home, which is way better than wasting your parent’s money. If one is a serious student and understands the importance of education, then yes sure thinking about college is the best choice. Bottom line is don’t cheat yourself and be honest with what you do.
"Going to college is useless" this is basically what Mr. Stephens is saying; but can we really think of a world without college? After reading this article, I want to go to college even more. For me, everyone should go to college. It's not because you acheived High School that you should stop learning. College is definately where we are going to develop our learning skills the most. So yes everyone should go to college.
ReplyDelete“If you can go to a top school, by all means, go. It doesn’t mean that you need to finish.” Most of the people are going to tell you that this sentence is pure nonsense, but I think that we can make a point from this. We have several examples nowadays of celebrities kids send to well-known institutuions; but do they really go there because they have the potential or because their parents are famous? So yes some people don't really need to go to college, or don't have the need to be focused at school.
The 5 reasons Mr. Stephens stated make senior who are going to apply to universities more stressed. Going to college is learning a job; but even more than that, going to college will help a person socially. I think if a person decide not to go to college, he will definately miss "the time of his life".
Do you really think that everyone should go to college? Countries like Taiwan currently have this sort of educational belief and they are finding that the country just cannot function with more than 85% of the population holding PhDs and hoping to work in upper level positions. While I was there, they had one news story break about a single truck driver job that had over 5000 applicants, all of whom held advanced college degrees. If we do that, who will want to do the 80% of the jobs that involve service industry? We actually do need people to be service industry workers, para-pros and professional technicians (plumbers, carpenters, fire fighters, electricians, etc) - they are the backbone of our society.
DeleteAt first when I started reading Mr’s Stephens’ article, I asked myself these two questions: Does he know enough about Colleges to complain about it? Or is he just giving us his opinion because he’s envious of those who attended college? Going to college really depends on people’s purposes; what they want to do as a job later, or if they’re going there for the social life, parties and all that stuff. I don’t agree when he says that “you might end up limiting yourself if you only socialize with people on your dorm floor and in your classes,” because one more time it depends on people. Some, who are really going to college to get focused in their classes, always getting on time and to actually take things seriously, may make only some friends, not to get too disturbed in their studies, but some others will maybe be more open-minded and make friends anywhere they’ll be going.
ReplyDeleteI also don’t agree when Mr Stephens says that “College is a sandbox that gives you a false sense of reality,” because I think College is definitely a good way to get ready before you start the real life. To be honest when I think college, I think socializing with many people on and off campus, I think parties and everything, but also that I’ll have to learn the things that will help me to get more independent in life, like cooking, cleaning up my apartment usually, shopping for the house, going by myself to all my classes…etc.
So should everyone, anyone, or no one plan to grad from college? In my opinion people should just do whatever looks good to them. But College is a good choice to get more experienced in what you’re looking to do as a job for later, to socialize with any kind of people and definitely to learn certain things in life nowadays. So I just believe that Mr Stephens does not seem enough experienced in colleges or universities to try to convince people that college is not necessary.
Mr. Stephens presented some interesting reasons as to why we should skip college, but I do feel that under most circumstances people should attend college or some form of higher education. So that later on they can be able to provide for themselves, especially in this economy.
ReplyDeleteA hundred years ago or even 50 years ago, simply having a high school degree in some parts of the world was already impressive, as most people barely finished high school. In this day and age however, not having a college degree is tough to sell to employers, especially if you plan to earn more than minimum wage. The fact is that today there are many college graduates looking for work. In what way would hiring a high school graduate with AP credit be the best option in the eyes of an employer, compared to a college graduate with a degree in the field?
One way a high school graduate might enter the workforce and compete against college graduates for the same position, is by having experience in that area (maybe from a summer job). Other than that most people believe in the importance of higher education. Even some actors, athletes, and directors who do not live their lives paycheck to paycheck have been known to halt their careers to further their education. An example is Academy Award winning director Steven Spielberg. He was in and out of college either because of poor grades or because of his career, but in the end despite the many awards he won, he went back to college and graduated. Some would say it was for self-fulfillment, others like Award winning actress and Harvard graduate Natalie Portman would say "I rather be smart then be an actress".
College is important, whether you go for your future job, for your parents, or for yourself. In the end, your education is what you make of it.
If your education is what you make it, why do you need to make it in college? Can't you make it as an apprentice? or a skilled, trained tradesperson? If you invested the same amount of time in learning a field through a mentor and your own sweat equity, wouldn't you know more than someone who just "took some classes?"
DeleteI do agree that over the last 60 years or so, uni has become much more "commonplace" than ever before. Okay, it's accepted, but is it necessary? or even good?
After reading this article, I just feel like going to college right now. I am not against the fact that college is not for everyone because we don’t all have the same ability of understanding. Some people may do better by doing self directed education rather than going to colleges. Mr. Stephens did not spend more than one two years in college but he is trying to show that college is not a good option. I completely agree with the facts that college is for everyone and it is a better way to go. It is true that young people in America have jobs that don’t require a college degree but those Jobs are not good. The majority of them have small jobs such as working at fast food.
ReplyDeleteYou don’t go to college just to get a degree but also to open up your mind and learn new stuff. College is a place where you can find diversity of people and know about other cultures and countries. By going to college, you can discover so many things about you that you ignored. In my opinions Mr. Stephens is trying to explain his laziness. Going to college is a decision you make to do things you like. We learn new topics which will help us to be whom we want to be. People go fast and succeed in their life when they do what they like. Going to college helps people to get ready for the professional life and it is increases our IQ.
It is a good thing for me to college because I want to learn new stuff and be an intellectual. Here in DRC, you need to have a college degree to get a good job. It is kind of an obligation to go to college here in Congo because it is sure that you won’t get a job without a degree. Good jobs require high education level here and you got to go to college. I want to make some change in my country and I need to study in order to realize that, it won’t happen if I don’t go to college. Everyone should go to college. College is a place where you learn to face reality of life. You may think of how much money you spend on paying for college but after all it pays back. You get a better job and you enjoy your life to the fullest.
You make a new point about wanting to become an intellectual being. So, while a uni degree may help you succeed more in the job market, the real reason you want to attend is to feed your intellectual curiosity. That's cool. you mention that in Congo you cannot succeed professionally without a degree, and you also make it sound like a degree will almost guarantee your happy career. In the US right now, (and in Taiwan as well) a degree is no guarantee of anything. They are saying that your generation is SOL in that you will have a huge % of degrees and no professional level jobs to do with them. In both the US and Taiwan many, many new grads are lining up for jobs as truck drivers, waiters, and other hourly (unskilled) jobs where people who opted for skilled trades, are in high demand. So, is uni just to get a "better" job? No go.
DeleteI think is one of the most real articles I have ever encountered. Dale J. Stephens is just pointing out the reality of all of this. In reason 1 he states “What you learn in college is generally the same skill set that you learn in a traditional school environment,” he said. “You learn how to follow directions, meet deadlines and memorize facts.” I totally agree with this statement because in the world of work you have to be able to think practically, independently and logically. College is not for everybody, not everybody is gifted with academic, creative or artistic skills. Everybody is different and that is what makes us unique and special in our own way. One thing that is encouraged in American systematic schools is individuality. Not being able to survive or not seeing the need to go to college does not mean that that person is stupid; they just have skills or abilities greater than college. College is mostly seen a platform to grow up from being dependent on your parents to being dependent on yourself. Although this is not entirely correct because your parents still pay for at least a 100% of your tuition as well as pocket money, you do somewhat lean to be independent. If all people go to college and are highly qualified it can lead to lack of employment and a point that Kumu made was if everybody goes to college who would do the jobs that don’t need you to go to college? In my opinion, college is the first step to independence. Independence comes with huge responsibilities and freedom. Success depends on how one uses their freedom and responsibilities. In conclusion, I think that the college experience should be in the middle of school and work so that one is fully armed for the real world.
ReplyDeleteNoni, welcome to the forum. It's good to see you here. Your point about college being the first step to independence confuses me because if your parents are paying for "100 of your tuition and pocket money" and you are attending classes which are taught by other professionals, what exactly are you doing to become independent? You need to be more specific about that. And since some people do not need college, are you saying that they don't need to become more independent?
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